Distance with hitting
 

While htting from a model pont of view appears simpler to me I can not for the life of me come close to the distance I could achieve while swinging( about 3 club difference). I know my mentor (yodasLuke) has stated it is the trick that is hardest to learn but for me (maybe because of physical issues) I cannot seem to use my right arm activelly without using my right hand resulting in the unbending of the right wrist resulting in casting etc. I suspect something in the lower pivot motion is required to make it work whether than pivot motion be active or passive.


Either case where do I begin drill wise etc. to get there. I have tried the right arm only and can't really make good contact with the ball which of course limits the distance.

As a thought process I drive my right hard as I can from the end of my backswing very hard right from the start. It is a reduced backswing so I do not believe I have over accelerated before I hit the ball.

Dave

Use the muscles of your right forearm (driving right forearm) instead of your right hand...


Practice with a non-automatic 3 barrel hitting stroke with your mid to short irons....with long irons and woods use the 4 barrel hitting stroke for distance shots. See 2-M-3 and 2-M-4 for combinations of power package thrust and pivot thrust. Mid to short irons use power package thrust...with the long irons and woods use pivot and package thrust. Work on this combination for 3 to 6 months...then revaluate your situation....I believe you will achieve your desired distances...

DG

I intend to keep bending the shaft against the clubhead lag (inertia) by actively rotating my pivot, straightenning my right arm and unbending my right wrist (PP#3 against the shaft using the PP#2 as a fulcrum) simultaneously. Yet, the latter two don't complete until way beyond impact.

forearm muscles?
 

I understand the advice you gave at the end of the post, but I'm confused about using the "muscles of your right forearm (driving right forearm)". The muscles of the forearm can be used in moving the fingers, in bending or arching the wrist, and in cocking and uncocking the wrist. But, it's the triceps that straighten and the biceps that bend the arm. The muscle power is mainly triceps.

Ted,

What triggers the triceps into action...the right forearm. See 1-F. The study 7-3. Next watch both Tomasello video series...you will hear Tommy talk about using the right forearm...not once does he mention the driving the right triceps. Tommy always references the right forearm...in fact, The Magic of the Right Forearm.

See...7-3..."it is absolutely MANDATORY that, Hitting or Swinging, it is the Right Forearm--not just the Right Hand and/or clubshaft--that must be thrown, or driven, into Impact per 7-2-3." or later in that same paragraph..."Remember, the Actual Angle of Approach of the Clubhead is determined by Ball Position (2-N) so the Cross Line position of the Right Forearm is ONLY the On Plane Forearm Thrust per 1-L-9/10/11. Even with the Pitch Basic Stroke...".

DG

I'm very familiar with all of the quotes as I have studied them until I was blue in the face. But staying on topic, I refer back to "the muscles of the right forearm" which was the question at hand. None of these muscles bend or straighten the right elbow, which in turn cocks and uncocks the left wrist. Do your "muscles of the right forearm" do such things? And, where are these words used in the book?

I like the image of "shaking the sugar off your arms at Impact"....should give you that snap.

Ted,

See 6-B-2-0..."Centrifugal Force, Accummulator #1, the muscles of both forearms, any--or all--are available to actuate this assembly."

At two different times, I experimented with driving the right triceps...after several weeks of daily practice, I began to lose the sweet feeling lag. Once I went back to using the right forearm, the sweet feeling of lag returned. Almost like Magic. Hence, the name....The Magic of the Right Forearm. I wouldn't be surprised that Homer went through the same experiment.

Remember section 20 is a section of triggers (triggering the release action). 10-20-B Right Arm Throw trigger....Right Forearm trigger. Please review the Tomasello videos. In video chapter 2 (The Arms Chapter) from Australia, Tommy Tomasello talks about driving that right forearm to a long right arm.

DG

Distance with hitting
 

If a hitter uses the "karate straight arm punch - heel of hand" as the image for his right hand thrust delivery function then it is a given that this procedure is one of bending and straightening of the right arm.

Bending is a job for the Biceps and straightening provides work for the Triceps.

The the workings of the forearm, independent of this bending and straightening process, are jobs for other departments.

Tomasello Tapes
 

I truly recommend that you guys put some time in on the Tomasello tapes...

DG

Delaware Golf...

I have been doing that..."down and out on the inclined plane." That is some seriously good stuff!

Great Comdpa,

Just a reminder from the letter series videos...Tommy said...start with the chips and pitches (with the right forearm) and slowly work it up to a full swing. Definitely use the chapter 12-5 basic motion, acquired motion, and Total Motion approach.

With some good practice time, the forearm muscles will strengthen and this version of swinging and/or hitting will become second nature.

DG

Don't take this the wrong way, but why did you switch if you were striking the ball better swinging?

DG,

I personally do not think that this is another "version of swinging and/or hitting".

To me, this is TGM personified, as Tommy speaks of using the hands and then let the body follow.

Sounds like a Hand Controlled Pivot Procedure to me. I am referencing the 2nd part of the Tomasello Letters on LBG.

Comdpa,

Just remember Tommy is not applying direct force with his hands. See section 5-0...where Homer makes the comment, "Learn to SWING THE HANDS, MONITOR THE HANDS....". See 10-11-0-1 and 10-11-0-3 and key in on the word "passive" and/or "passively" while commenting about the use of the right arm for swinging or the right arm swing.

DG

Thanks for the reminder buddy...

I like to think of it as "the intent to uncock the club down
and out on plane" causes the body and thus the hands to react correctly" - in exact accordance with 5-0.

I had cancer in my rear leg and the leg to above the knee had to be amputated.At the Canton forum it was felt that hitting would be easier that swinging because I couldn't get the pivot I needed for swinging. But never fear with the generous help of the people on the forum and others I'll get it back sufficient to play a ok game.

Dave

I normally employ swinging, but as when I was with Yoda, I actually discovered that I got equal or more distance from hitting.

BUT...that doesn't always hold true. Call it leakage or whatever but the following are my problems...

1. Starting too fast on the downstroke where, even though it doesn't feel like it, I top out on accelerating, that doesn't mean the club is slowing down, just not accelerating anymore.

2. Rhythm, there is a big difference IMO between Hitters and Swingers and this is something that I struggle with all the time.

For hitting, I practice waggle (not a good term in this case) over the top of the ball. Starting at Impact Fix, back one foot, then drive out over the top of the ball to follow through and then repeat without pausing.

For swinging, I start at Impact Fix, then go to the top and make the move down to release where I force the uncock keeping on the incline plane. Start slow and then speed up for three or four reps.

This kind of syncs me up for the difference between the two, cause if I mix the rhythm between either, I have major power leakage.

I have tried and tried to swing and get the distance that I can get hitting and have not had any luck. I really believe in what Homer said, if quick swing, if strong hit. Each person's individual genetics and characteristics play the dominent role on what way a person will be able to swing the club with the most authority. I also have learned from experience that while it's nice to try to learn both, I think each person has a natural tendency. That first time you ever picked up a club did you push it or pull it... That's usually the answer to how you should play..

This sure puts my frustration with searching for a swing in perspective. Go get 'em Dave.

DG

I have looked at Tomasello videos per your suggestion and the down and out could be significant to what I could be doing wrong. I still am a little confused in that with the backswing swivel he describes what I believe is swinging yet the right arm participation sounds like hitting. The other area I have not understood was in the australian tapes he indicated strength was needed for hitting yet after his other video I am wondering why are the strength requirements at all different between hitting and swinging? YodaLuke never felt strength was a requirement when I talked to him.

Dave

Dave,

Tommy did not mean strength to be a "He-Man" type of strength.

He was merely differentiating the use of muscular thrust (right triceps) to drive the club in hitting with the use of centrifugal force to throw the club out in swinging.

Dave

Backswing swivel in the video per the 1 to 2 position in the slow motion sequence....it's a drill. However, at normal speed, Tommy is performing a Full Sweep Load....for swinging...as Tommy is starting the backswing with his right forearm, he is also folding his right elbow at the same time. The action that turns the left wrist is the action of shoulder rotation. It's a natural move...on the other hand, for hitting, Tommy is also starting back with his right forearm and folding (cocking) his right elbow but he is resisting the turning action of the left wrist per 7-19-1 which reads..."by resisting the Backstroke motion for Drive Loading"....that action is created with a punch basic right arm motion and the realization that the left wrist must not turn in this case. So, for swinging it's a natural move…for hitting is a manipulative move.

As far as strength is concerned, yes, you need a degree of strength for both hitting and swinging. I'm not talking about heavy lifting strength...my reference to strength is more in regards to repetitive strength and/or endurance versus the ability to lift heavy weights. Consistency on shot after shot takes repetitive strength.... conditioning per the stroke pattern you’re employing.

DG