Need some simple ideas.
 

Hello all, I am pretty new here and don't post very often, but its because I don't feel I know enough to ask an intelligent question. But, I do read the forums quite often.

Tell me if I've got this right or guide me where I'm wrong.

From the top of my backswing, is my goal to get my hands to impact fix by traveling straight to that point? In other words, I know where my hands should be at impact, so I am trying to get from the hands up over my right shoulder to impact in as straight of a line as possible. Provided this is correct, should I try to continue on that downward, outward direction with my hands or is the position the 'end of the line' for my efforts?

First don't wait till you feel you can ask an itelligent question, cause it could be very well your question is what others are wondering about also. As they say there are no dumb questions. From my experience, I know I have to be in the top 10 for what may be considered a dumb question, but each time I am surprised at the helpful, KIND, responses. We are all learning..

I would say the idea of driving the hands down to impact would be better thought of as driving them through that position. At for me anyway, cause it is like those to try and hit the ball vs those who hit through the ball. The first way can promote quiting or might create a mental image of such.

I think you are looking for the aiming point, you might wish to do a search and see if that gives or supports what you are thinking.

Less fog
 

Exgolfpro: From the top of my backswing, is my goal to get my hands to impact fix by traveling straight to that point?

Martee: I would say the idea of driving the hands down to impact would be better thought of as driving them through that position.

I think exgolfpro is asking is the goal, from the Top of the Backswing to Impact Fix and beyond, to have the hands travel on a straight line through his nominated points?
Would a less ambiguous answer be either Yes/No or not always? If so, can someone tell us which is correct please?

Strav,
Thanks for your response. I guess my question was two fold. Is impact the end of the line for conscious manipulation AND, as you questioned, is it a straight line move? Thanks.

I think that straight line delivery path is an expression that can lead to confusion ... I am confused ...

Using various pro swings on V1 software, I have plotted a consistent part of hand ( pp3) or butt of club on the downswing and there are no straight lines when viewed from face on. There are curves of varying radius but no consistent straight line as one might imagine from looking at the images in 10-23-A.

I have read somewhere that this straight line is actually the line of thrust for directing pp3. This seems to make sense BUT 10-23-0 reads "...these paths are actually the paths taken by the hands - not the clubhead"

I would be grateful if someone could provide images of this true staright line delivery path.

Thanks

To the Gallery
 

Yoda already showed us exactly where the delivery line is and how to locate it. Watch the video named Dowels_wedges.

There seems to be some reluctance to give you a simple yes or no answer.
Why you are being directed elsewhere to perhaps misinterpret something that you may have already seen is beyond me.

Check out the video on Delivery I think . . . You need to become familiar with the Right Forearm Angle of Approach.

Essentially you get your Right Forearm On-Plane pointing down the Plane Line at Fix. Then you just take it up and RIGHT BACK to that point.

You can use what you have described above. Impact Fix Hand location. This is what some people erroniously call Aiming Point. It is just taking your hands back through the Impact Fix Hand Location in which your hands should appear to cover your left toe at Fix.

Count me in here. IMO, straight line is primarily a mental image and not physically achieveable in a dynamic golf stroke. I have also looked for a true straight line using V1 and it doesn't exist with any pros that I looked at.

I have seen the video where Yoda uses the dowels to show straight line but i am still not convinced that the hands follow this path... i , like you SonicDoom, am waiting for evidence... thrust direction may be straight line feeling but hands travel in curves.

Maybe if viewed down the line the hands might go in a straight line?

Trying to get this straight
 

The Straight Line Delivery Path, which is made possible by Hip Slide and correct Axis Tilt will allow the hands to move in a straight line, but only for a short distance from Top 8-6 to approximately Downstroke 8-8. The Delivery Path directs the thrust at a specific Aiming Point on the Plane Line.

It maximizes the effect of the Endless Belt Effect.

Delivery Path Graphics -- Prerequisite For Discussion
 

The Delivery Path of the Hands and the Aiming Point of the Thrust are concepts unique to The Golfing Machine. Collectively, they constitute Component #23 and are illustrated in Photos 9-3-6/11.

As Golfbulldog and Sonic_Doom have observed, the actual Deivery Path of the Hands is not nearly as 'long' as illustrated. However, as Drew has pointed out, with Axis Tilt, it can and does exist, at least momentarily. And the Delivery Path of the Thrust is always the Straight Line toward the Aiming Point.

For the benefit of all, we need illustrations so we might intelligently discuss this most important concept. To that end, I have asked Annikan to re-post his photos plotting the Line Path from an earlier thread. He will have them up soon.

Thanks in advance, Annikan!

Thanks - as a "Doubting Thomas"...
 

Thanks Yoda and Annikin, if I can see it, better still - feel it, then I am a believer. Look forward to the pics.

Top Arc/Straight Line - Swinging





Straight Line





Angled Line - Hitting




No Belt...One Big Pulley - Full Sweep

Incredible... now I believe
 

Energy efficient light bulbs beaming bright now! and only a small carbon footprint!

Thanks for the rapid response Annikan and Yoda - I see that PP3 is plotted and the delivery paths of the swings vary accordingly.

I think that the majority of pro players i had assessed earlier ( on V1 software) would fit into a circle delivery path... but varying in radius. More dynamic power hitters having smaller radius... Sergio Garcia must be pretty straight line though~?

I would say that Ben Doyle's downswing has the most obvious straight line. Easy to see because he takes it to the top and not end ( but then if I can make it to start up swivel by Ben's age then I will consider myself lucky !!:) ).

Ben, I believe, states that he is "pivot powered" but "mind in hands". His hands ( PP3) never leave that straight line until pulley.

No matter what you call it his hands are feeding back ( command post) to his pivot!! No one would ever teach Ben's pivot as it is now ... but it does everything a pivot is required to do = move the hands where they need to go, trace a straight line and sustain lag... the fact that his zone 1 is able to achieve this despite the individual limitations that age has placed upon his body proves, to me at least, that his hands (mind) are truly controlling his pivot!


"The Delivery Path of the Hands and the Aiming Point of the Thrust are concepts unique to The Golfing Machine. Collectively, they constitute Component #23 and are illustrated in Photos 9-3-6/11. " by Yoda

Now I see it ...thanks.

It will help alot of people... I can't stop telling people about Homer and the society of people that he inspired!

Hats Off To Annikan!
 

Thanks, Annikan. Great work! :salut:

You're a Charter Member of the LBG East Coast Support Team, and we appreciate it!

:)

Thanks for the illustrations Annikan; they shed a lot of light.

I can't see these illustrations.....is there a way to retrieve them or find them in the archives? Thanks.

3Putt

I have prepared this photo for you in the hope that it may answer your question.



I chose a swing video of Tiger Woods where the camera was positioned at an angle, that would be more-or-less in line with the direction the hands would follow on their path to their impact location. I then used a spline tool to trace the hand arc path.

You can see that the hand arc path is U-shaped. It is impossible for the left hand to travel in a straight line in a full golf swing - because the left hand is merely the end of the left arm lever, which is swinging from a fulcrum point (left shoulder socket joint). Theoretically, the left hand should swing in a circular arc - if the left shoulder remained stationary in space. However, during the downswing, the left shoulder socket (fulcrum point for the left arm lever) is moving down-out-forward and that changes a circular hand arc path into an U-shaped handarc path.

However, as Yoda stated, it "feels" like one is pulling the hands down in a straight line thrust direction towards an aiming point.

Jeff.

thanks to 3putt for resurrecting a very interesting question.

Jeff,

I really like that explanation. Before I started studying TGM, I believed the hands moved in a circle. In the book, Diane's hands are always moving in the same way as your picture of Tiger. Probably very basic stuff to you guys, but as a rookie I appreciate the help you just gave in understanding why...

Thanks,
Kevin

help
 

i can not get these to work.

Neither can I, unfortunately.
In the book, if you look closely there is a faint black line going from the delivery path and down to the ball. In that sense it is a straight line, I believe.

The hands are moving in a straight line - away from center - to the aiming point. The thrust continues at the aiming point, even when the left arm 'leash' causes the hands to move in a circle (hands have reached the end of the radius). That is where the pulley is in the endless belt. It is the essence of an automatic, snap release (see Sergio or Hogan).

Everything else being equal, an aiming point farther back creates more 'snap' for power (longer clubs). A point farther forward, less 'snap' for control (wedge/pitch shots).

Very cool!

Hi EDZ! Uhhmmm, is this quote from the Green Lantern deluxe decoder ring set?

The hands are moving in a straight line - away from center - to the aiming point. The thrust continues at the aiming point, even when the left arm 'leash' causes the hands to move in a circle (hands have reached the end of the radius). That is where the pulley is in the endless belt. It is the essence of an automatic, snap release (see Sergio or Hogan).

Everything else being equal, an aiming point farther back creates more 'snap' for power (longer clubs). A point farther forward, less 'snap' for control (wedge/pitch shots).


I am, once again, happily amazed. How the heck did HK (blessings be upon him) figure this out?