Hi Yoda,
In your driving the golfball video,you STRESS making sure your right forearm is on plane before you will even begin your swing. Would you please go into some detail on this. How can I tell it's on plane...Does it change for each club.....type of shot ...etc ...?????
I know the question is for Yoda but I will attempt to make an answer until he does....
Lets just start with what is a plane of motion. A flat inclined plane (like a pitched roof- glossary) means that this is what the clubshaft travels on. The clubface may open or close but the clubshaft always rests upon it. You may notice that no matter what the incline the base line or plane line remains constant (1-L).
For the right forearm to be on plane and to enable a zero shift stroke the right forearm must be a virtual extension of the club (in the cup of the right hand with no wrist cock...eg moe norman) and since the address starts with the right wrist in a vertical condition means that the right forearm also rests on that plane.
So what is the inclined plane... im glad you asked .... in the ideal application it is the turned shoulder plane but it can be rotated but in other words it is where your right shoulder is going to turn to.... draw a line from the ball to the place where your right shoulder turns to at the end or top of the backstroke.....
So basically to give a direct answer and sum up - right forearm an virtual extension of the club from side view by the right wrist being in a level condition with no wrist cock and the clubshaft being in the cup of the right hand. The right forearm will then automatically point at the baseline. Then you also point the forearm to the point that your shoulder is going to turn to..... and evola an onplane forearm....
Great, clear, concise description for us Basic crowd. The photo is the icing.
Well done. =D>
Charlie
Thank you Matt,
The pictures clear up a lot of confusion. Would you entertain the thought of explaining the different hinge action with pictures ?
If you do a right forearm pickup properly, then can't you start with the right arm not on plane because it gets on plane at waist high on the backswing? It's very awkward and the club seems to stand on toe with the right arm on the shaft plane at address. If your elbow is on the plane then you should be ok as long as you don't cock the right wrist. right?
I'm demonstrating a zero shift here and an onplane right forearm at address......
Nice pic Mathew! Are you a Hitter or Swinger?
I think I was loading for hitting on this shot....can do both....
Thanks for the photo and discussion. Hopefully my measurements are close enough and I am not being too precise but here are some observations of the photo positions and a question. Would appreciate your comments or clarification from a zero shift perspective.
1 (O)-A line drawn through the two hand positions to the ground does not intersect the plane line.
2 (O)-The hands at address are below the TSP.
3 (O)-Considering the sweet spot plane and the address shaft plane both pass through the "hands/PP3" and assuming the right forearm rests on the appropriate plane, that plane is flatter than the TSP. Or, the right shoulder turns to a point that is not on the "preselected plane" (ref. 10-13-D).
4(?)-In the downstroke, do the hands return to the address position or move down the TSP?
I have been comparing some down the line views of several pro players on the Redgoat smugmug site and have some observations and questions.
I did not look at all the players but I didn't find any who started with the shaft in line with their right forearm, not even Steve Elkington, unless I am misinterpreting the concept. However almost all of them had the shaft in line with the right forearm at or near impact.
By starting with the shaft and forearm on plane and tracing the plane with PP 3 am I then eliminating extra moves or shifts to get to proper impact?
I have been comparing some down the line views of several pro players on the Redgoat smugmug site and have some observations and questions.
I did not look at all the players but I didn't find any who started with the shaft in line with their right forearm, not even Steve Elkington, unless I am misinterpreting the concept. However almost all of them had the shaft in line with the right forearm at or near impact.
By starting with the shaft and forearm on plane and tracing the plane with PP 3 am I then eliminating extra moves or shifts to get to proper impact?
Steve
It's true that most Tour players don't set up with their right forearm on the shaft plane. However, they all get it there at impact. So the way I see it is...why not put it there to begin with? Isn't it easier to get back into that position rather than try to seek it in the downswing?
Gentlemen,
The difference is ... Adjusted Address vs. Impact Fix...If you set up Impact Fix you are setting the right forearm and clubshaft on-plane with each other...If you move the hands back to adjusted address or a MID-BODY LOCATION you will see a difference in the relationship of the clubshaft to the right forearm ... Try it , See it, Do it Again and Again!!!
Food for Thought.... Hittin' Machine Set-up...Impact Fix
Swingin' Machine Set-up ... Adjusted Address
Suggested Reading last sentence of 10-9-A, 10-9-B
"These are just merely "useful" not "have to"
To know the book...Is not just for reading the Book...Rather it is to do what is in the book...DO THE BOOK!!!
I have been comparing some down the line views of several pro players on the Redgoat smugmug site and have some observations and questions.
I did not look at all the players but I didn't find any who started with the shaft in line with their right forearm, not even Steve Elkington, unless I am misinterpreting the concept. However almost all of them had the shaft in line with the right forearm at or near impact.
By starting with the shaft and forearm on plane and tracing the plane with PP 3 am I then eliminating extra moves or shifts to get to proper impact?
Steve
There may be some risk/reward reason to use plane shifts at the Tour level? But a zero shift has to be easier to reproduce once hatched. Even Hogan brought his hands high at the top. Then (while he focused our attention on his left hip), he dropped his hands/club about 6 inches without moving the club, then he started down. This put his hands on the TSP, bent his right wrist and supinated his left wrist. I think that would be tres difficile.
I have had instructors tell to "just let the hands drop from the top". They didn't tell me how or why. Maybe that's what they we're talking about.
I'd rather KISS, and keep at the zero shift. YMMV.
Wow talk about a defogger!!! All this time i thought the right forearm had to be on plane even for the mid body hands. So that means that both when hitting and swinging the right forearm starts offplane in the standard address position. If this is correct which it obviously must be then i think there are countless numbers among us that misunderstood.
As a footnote Homer actually states standard address a his preferred procedure for both hitting and swinging in chapter 12. He interestingly mentions 10-9-A Standard being "especially useful" for swinging and 10-9-B for the same hitting however. I wonder how close he was to using the Impact address in chapter 12?
I'm still light headed from finally learning unless we start at impact address the right forearm will not be in line with the shaft.
Gentlemen,
The difference is ... Adjusted Address vs. Impact Fix...If you set up Impact Fix you are setting the right forearm and clubshaft on-plane with each other...If you move the hands back to adjusted address or a MID-BODY LOCATION you will see a difference in the relationship of the clubshaft to the right forearm ... Try it , See it, Do it Again and Again!!!
Food for Thought.... Hittin' Machine Set-up...Impact Fix
Swingin' Machine Set-up ... Adjusted Address
Suggested Reading last sentence of 10-9-A, 10-9-B
"These are just merely "useful" not "have to"
To know the book...Is not just for reading the Book...Rather it is to do what is in the book...DO THE BOOK!!!
Gentlemen,
My good friend Annikan teaches players of all levels including members of the PGA, Nationwide, Hooters, etc...tours. Play close attention, we're lucky to have him!
.... in the ideal application it is the turned shoulder plane but it can be rotated but in other words it is where your right shoulder is going to turn to.... draw a line from the ball to the place where your right shoulder turns to at the end or top of the backstroke.....
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