Pivot - Active or Passive

[oztrainee]

By talking to various Ai about Pivot controlled Hands and Hands controlled Pivot

Or

Pivot Power Hand Controlled Pivot

A - Some people look at it as a bearing (Hands controlled Pivot). When the bearing become rusty, then the pivot stop rotating -Passive

b - Some people look at it as a electric Motor (Pivot Controlled Hands) When you stop supplying power to the motor, then the pivot stop rotating - Active

Or we have to look at the pivot as a mixture of both
Let the hands to guide it before Impact, and have to really work it during impact interval?

[6bmike]

The hands aren't educated until they control the pivot. Control! Not replace or substitute. The hands train or designs the pivot- its HIP MOTION -so it can deliver the hands to the ball without bending the plane line.

You want to use the pivot more- go right ahead- it's trained. You want to use the arms more- go right ahead- they're trained. When the mind is in the hands, on the downswing, it is pretty hard for the pivot to be the boss.

[jim_0068]

Great post 6b

Just because you have a very active pivot doesn't mean you are using "pivot controlled hands." It simply means you are using a lot more pivot to whallop the ball.

if you are TRULY using pivot controlled hands then you are simply moving the pivot back and forth with no regard for where your hands/arms/etc are and just relying on the pivot to make your hands to what they are supposed to do.

[mb6606]

When this question comes up I always refer back to the video of Homer swinging in the gallery. I figure Homer knew what he wanted to do in his own swing.

[comdpa]

Great post 6b

Just because you have a very active pivot doesn't mean you are using "pivot controlled hands." It simply means you are using a lot more pivot to whallop the ball.

if you are TRULY using pivot controlled hands then you are simply moving the pivot back and forth with no regard for where your hands/arms/etc are and just relying on the pivot to make your hands to what they are supposed to do.

I agree jim_0068.

A true pivot controlled hand procedure negates the active use of the hands.

[Yoda]

The hands aren't educated until they control the pivot. Control! Not replace or substitute. The hands train or design the pivot- its HIP MOTION -so it can deliver the hands to the ball without bending the plane line.

You want to use the pivot more- go right ahead- it's trained. You want to use the arms more- go right ahead- they're trained. When the mind is in the hands, on the downswing, it is pretty hard for the pivot to be the boss.

Really good stuff, Mike. Thanks!

[oztrainee]

So, I presume you all look at Pivot as a BEARING rather then it is a Electric Motor

Now, another related question. I always believe that Hitting the ball further is all about be able to generate more speed.

Now, Pivot is a massive vehicle which transports the Power Package Assembly, therefore if I am correct Pivot is not giving any speed but only the hands are (Endless Belt effect)
So could I have a firm sort of defination about Pivot Power, according to the previous debate, pivot is just a Bearing and have minimum Kinetic Energy. But if we look at it from a different Angle the inside moving the outside. So is the pivot a Electric Motor or It is a Bearing?

Please really give some precise thought to it, rather then just answer the question from the book.

[comdpa]

So, I presume you all look at Pivot as a BEARING rather then it is a Electric Motor

Now, another related question. I always believe that Hitting the ball further is all about be able to generate more speed.

Now, Pivot is a massive vehicle which transports the Power Package Assembly, therefore if I am correct Pivot is not giving any speed but only the hands are (Endless Belt effect)
So could I have a firm sort of defination about Pivot Power, according to the previous debate, pivot is just a Bearing and have minimum Kinetic Energy. But if we look at it from a different Angle the inside moving the outside. So is the pivot a Electric Motor or It is a Bearing?

Please really give some precise thought to it, rather then just answer the question from the book.

Pivot without the Hands and Hands without the Pivot is like using a water pistol to hunt for quails (sorry, I could not resist!).

You need to marry the Pivot with the Hands and that is the whole foundation of TGM - Pivot Powered Hand Controlled Pivot.
Too many people do not understand this relationship between the Hands and the Pivot and thus TGM degenerates into a "Hand" camp and a "Pivot" camp.

Think of the Pivot in swinging as a merry-go-round. The faster the merry-go-round spins, the faster your speed when you are "thrown-off"

What are the Pivot components?

They are:

Pivot
Shoulder Turn
Hip Turn
Hip Action
Knee Action
Foot Action

The Shoulders are the farthest (from the center) and the fastest moving components of the pivot and they transmit the motion of the pivot to the arms.

Power is transmitted to the hands and it is not independently generated by the hands.

[Yoda]

...the whole foundation of TGm - Pivot Powered Hand Controlled Pivot.

Right on, Comdpa. Thanks!

[Mike O]

So, I presume you all look at Pivot as a BEARING rather then it is a Electric Motor

Now, another related question. I always believe that Hitting the ball further is all about be able to generate more speed.

Now, Pivot is a massive vehicle which transports the Power Package Assembly, therefore if I am correct Pivot is not giving any speed but only the hands are (Endless Belt effect)
So could I have a firm sort of defination about Pivot Power, according to the previous debate, pivot is just a Bearing and have minimum Kinetic Energy. But if we look at it from a different Angle the inside moving the outside. So is the pivot a Electric Motor or It is a Bearing?

Please really give some precise thought to it, rather then just answer the question from the book.

Oz,
I've highlighted the part of your post that I am addressing-
Now, another related question. I always believe that Hitting the ball further is all about be able to generate more speed.

I'm not very good with equations and physics - so I might be a duck in hunting season on this one but it's not just speed that's required to hit the ball further. It's the formula for Kinetic Energy that's important- KE=1/2mass x Velocity squared

So the greater the pivot lag the greater the mass is rotating around creating the following two examples where the faster velocity of the clubhead in example two produces a much lower kinetic energy amount - due to the lower mass.
Example 1: 1/2 x 180= 90 x (50 x 50) = 225,000
Example 2: 1/2 x 90 = 45 x (60 x 60) = 162,000

So in the first example you've got less velocity 50 but more mass 180 and a total kinetic energy applied to the ball of 225,000

Second example you've got less mass 90 but an increased velocity of the clubhead of 60 squared, creating a total of kinetic energy applied to the ball of 162,000.

So for a practical example, if you throw the club away on the downswing- it starts to swing around a much shorter radius (left wrist vs the left shoulder) and because of that the speed in mph increases significantly but since you've got little mass in the clubhead itself and you've added nothing to it- the kinetic energy is very low.

I'm sure someone can verify or refute the principle involved here- and maybe even be able to restate the equation with the appropriate unit labels, etc.

Oz- I know this just addresses one issue in your post- you may still have others.